Thursday, November 4, 2010

Interprovincial planning made a little easier

Yesterday, Gatineau's STO transit system launched a new trip planner called Plani-Bus (public transit utilities seem to have an unhealthy obsession with word-splices), a new system that was able to be combined with OC Transpo's trip planner to make cross-river public transit use a little more convenient for riders.

Just to try it out, I went to OCTranspo.com and asked for a trip plan from the Rideau Centre to the Casino du Lac Leamy, and it worked. At least I assume it worked, I didn't actually try the prescribed travel plan results.

Seems like a common-sense solution that is probably overdue, but will certainly be appreciated by interprovincial riders moving forward. Hopefully further integration of the two utilities--including timing complementary routes well at transfer points--will follow soon, too.

10 comments:

WJM said...

Now if only STO would do something about its illogical and inefficient — at least for passengers — regular routes.

There's an event I go to in the north end industrial area of Hull every year, on a Saturday morning. It would be about a 15-minute direct trip from downtown Ottawa. But there is no direct trip. You meander through the west end tacky suburbs of Hull, almost into Aylmer, for over an hour. Adding the time it takes to get to the STO start point on Rideau Street in the first place, it is actually more time-efficient for me to walk the 10.2 km distance than it is to take transit.

It's idiotic. And it's how STO does business. Does anyone wonder why the modal split is so vastly different on the two sides of the river?

Anonymous said...

@WJM

So what you're saying is that you would like express service, from Ottawa to a northern Hull industrial park on a Saturday, and that STO is idiotic for not providing such a service?

Perhaps there is little demand for transporting Ottawa residents to a northern Hull industrial park during rush hour on a weekday, let alone on a weekend. After all. Even you only use it once per year.

Why don't you try getting yourself to the heart of Ottawa's industrial park. Say, the middle of Lancaster or Sheffield. Try that on a weekday after 8:30 AM. Or try getting back from there before 3 PM, or after 7 PM. Those companies are open all night, yet OC Transpo only runs rush hour service.

Is that idiotic? Maybe. Who cares.


I like this site, but damn is it ever full of whiny people demanding the exact thing that they want when they want it. Why do you people feel like your $2.50 entitles you to have taxpayers bring you wherever you want, as fast as you want, with as little inconvenience as possible?

Get a car or quit whining.

WJM said...

So what you're saying is that you would like express service, from Ottawa to a northern Hull industrial park on a Saturday, and that STO is idiotic for not providing such a service?

No, I would like STO, and all transit utilities, to have routes, at all service times, that are more linear, intuitive, and efficient, rather than meandering,nonsensical, and time-wasting.

The industrial park in question is walking distance from the Freeman parcobus and future Crappybus station, BTW.

And I don't like "express" buses on the Ottawa side, during weekday peak hours, so I can't imagine why I'd want expresses in the contrary direction in Gatineau on the weekend.

So now, anonymous coward, please go find someone else whose mouth you can put words in. Have a nice day.

Cowardly Lion said...

To your last point, would naming myself three random letters make me somehow more brave? Because I could easily choose the letters 'WJM'. Maybe your own lack of an avatar could be construed as cowardice, since I am not able to recognize you if I see your face on the street.

Now to address your actual point, rather than a cowardly straw man like you used with me, why not replace the word 'express' with 'direct' or 'linear'.

So you would have STO employ a direct linear line from Ottawa to a northern industrial park on a Saturday, rather than their current route that serves the western residential neighborhood en route to serving your once-a-year needs and actually getting you there.

I say again, try getting to the middle of Sheffield at any time of the day on Saturday - meandering or not.

Your original point sought to assert that STO does business in this idiotic way, but you had no problem flipping your argument around in your rebuttal to say that you also hate OC Transpo's routing choices.

So I say to you again, why should STO (or OC Transpo) tailor their route to serve your high and mighty ass, rather than the people who live along the route in "tacky" western Hull?

Isn't it possible that you are just whining (as is your usual, non-anonymous m.o.), and that STO is not idiotic?

I don't want to put words in your mouth, so I'll quote our conclusion that you believe this case is another example of "why the modal split is so vastly different on the two sides of the river".

So now, identifiable monogrammed noble brave dude, please go find someone else who will allow you to flip-flop, deflect and generally talk down to. Here's a suggestion: how about the professionals who designed the Saturday route that you are too cowardly to name by number. I cannot seem to locate a route that approaches Aylmer before doubling back and taking over an hour to reach Freeman.

Perhaps you should re-read the article above and note that your hyperbole could be easily refuted with the help of the trip planner.

Then again, that would probably disallow anyone from specifically pointing out why the residential west end is better served on a Saturday, than having the taxpayers of Gatineau subsidize your once-a-year inter-provincial patronage that would see you ride directly into the industrial park with the whole bus to yourself.

WJM said...

To your last point, would naming myself three random letters make me somehow more brave? Because I could easily choose the letters 'WJM'.

Sure. But I'm registered, my full name has already been cited on this site, and I have a profile with an email address linked. You, on the other hand, have the false courage that some people get posting anonymously, and others get with drink.

Now to address your actual point, rather than a cowardly straw man like you used with me, why not replace the word 'express' with 'direct' or 'linear'.

In large part because they don't mean the same thing.

So you would have STO employ a direct linear line from Ottawa to a northern industrial park on a Saturday

No, I would rather have STO employ as direct a route as possible from downtown to their Freeman hub, serving the industrial park along the way. And the same in all directions. At all times of day and week.

rather than their current route that serves the western residential neighborhood en route

Only at the cost of time and route inefficiencies.

to serving your once-a-year needs and actually getting you there.

No, to serve the needs of all users. Lineal, logical routes, not convoluted spaghetti-strings, are the best way to serve a wide variety of users. Transit planners understood that when they ran vehicles on rails. They collectively lost their heads when the world moved to “flexible” buses.

I say again, try getting to the middle of Sheffield at any time of the day on Saturday - meandering or not.

Walk from the 125. You're welcome.

Your original point sought to assert that STO does business in this idiotic way, but you had no problem flipping your argument around in your rebuttal to say that you also hate OC Transpo's routing choices.

How is that a flip? My position on bus routing is the same everywhere: make them direct, logical, intuitive, linear, don't ask one route to be too many different things, don't clog up a BRT system with so-called "Express" buses.

why should STO (or OC Transpo) tailor their route to serve your high and mighty ass

They shouldn't. They should tailor them to serve sense and logic and efficiency.

rather than the people who live along the route in "tacky" western Hull?

They would also be better served by more direct and linear service between major termini, rather than meandering routes that take an hour minutes to get anywhere because they try to go everywhere.

Isn't it possible that you are just whining (as is your usual, non-anonymous m.o.), and that STO is not idiotic?

More anonymity-fuelled courage, Lion?

I cannot seem to locate a route that approaches Aylmer before doubling back and taking over an hour to reach Freeman.

The 39. It crosses the former Hull municipal line into Aylmer.

The current Sat. timetable departs Rideau at 8:25, to arrive at Freeman (if on time) at 9:25. The summer timetable, the last time I bothered, took slightly longer, which is why of late I have walked.

Perhaps you should re-read the article above and note that your hyperbole could be easily refuted with the help of the trip planner.

I have the STO map and the 39 timetable open.

Then again, that would probably disallow anyone from specifically pointing out why the residential west end is better served on a Saturday, than having the taxpayers of Gatineau subsidize your once-a-year inter-provincial patronage that would see you ride directly into the industrial park with the whole bus to yourself.

I have never had the bus to myself. Where do you get this idea that the indusrial park is the destination for the BUS? It's the destination for ME. Different concepts, I know, but here goes: a passenger can request a stop at a designated stopping place at any point of the bus route's route before its terminus point.

sewa mobil said...

Nice article, thanks for the information.

WJM said...

I had a lengthy comment prepared, and it went poof. Here goes, again:

1. Cowardly lion, my real name has been used before on this site, and my registered profile has my real email attached to it. You, on the other hand...

2. The industrial park is not the destination. Freeman, a major hub, is. Direct-line service (not express; contrary to what you believe, you can't make words mean stuff that they don't mean) to Freeman would have the incidental effect of providing direct-line service to the Jean-Proulx area.

3. The 39. I checked, and it actually crosses into the former Aylmer municipal limites during its meandering hour-long (if on time) trajectory outbound from Rideau Street.

4. The residential areas would also be better served by being along more-linear routes which connect major termini.

Cowardly Lion said...

@WJM

Are you seriously still going on about this? I called you out 5 days ago and every time I revisit this site you are still moaning (and lying) about the same thing.

1) Your real name has been used before? But you will not reveal it now? Your email address attached to your profile is equally nondescript: ag737@ncf.ca

Do I call you 'Dubya' or do I call you 'Aggie' or Boeing man? You need to let go of this notion that you are so transaparent and that everyone else need be.

2) Express or direct or linear is all semantics to me, but to you apparently it means the world. Point is, you demanded a faster, less meandering route from Ottawa to Freeman because that's precisely what the STO's mandate should be - to serve your needs.

3) So you checked, did you? You do realize that the sunject of this article is that everyone - even anonymous nobodies like myself - can now check for themselves. You want to go from Rideau/Sussex to Freeman Transit Station on a Saturday morning and you still insist that it takes over an hour?

Then how do you explain this?


That's right. Bus #21 departing Rideau at 10:30 AM on Saturday and arriving at Freeman Terminus at 11:01 AM and never approaching Aylmer. Total time 31 minutes, which includes 1 minute of walking time on Rideau.


4) Maybe bus 39 serves the residential neighborhood of Aylmer. Maybe it doesn't. Frankly I think you are not the least trustworthy source on these matters. Besides, what makes you say those residents would be better served with a linear route to Rideau Street? Because that's where you would want to go if you lived there? Get over yourself.

Seriously. Get over yourself.

Cowardly Lion said...

@WJM

Are you seriously still going on about this? I called you out 5 days ago and every time I revisit this site you are still moaning (and lying) about the same thing.

1) Your real name has been used before? But you will not reveal it now? Your email address attached to your profile is equally nondescript: ag737@ncf.ca

Do I call you 'Dubya' or do I call you 'Aggie' or do I call you 'Boeing man'? You need to let go of this notion that you are so transaparent and that everyone else need be.

2) Express or direct or linear is all semantics to me, but to you apparently it means the world. Point is, you demanded a faster, less meandering route from Ottawa to Freeman because that's precisely what the STO's mandate should be - to serve your needs.

Please spare us all the red herring.

3) So you checked, did you? You do realize that the sunject of this article is that everyone - even anonymous nobodies like myself - can now check for themselves. You want to go from Rideau/Sussex to Freeman Transit Station on a Saturday morning and you still insist that it takes over an hour?

Then how do you explain this?


That's right. Bus #21 departing Rideau at 10:30 AM on Saturday and arriving at Freeman Terminus at 11:01 AM and never approaching Aylmer. Total time 31 minutes, which includes 1 minute of walking time on Rideau.


4) Maybe bus 39 serves the residential neighborhood of Aylmer. Maybe it doesn't. Frankly I think you are not the least trustworthy source on these matters. Besides, what makes you say those residents would be better served with a linear route to Rideau Street? Because that's where you would want to go if you lived there? Get over yourself.

Seriously. Get over yourself.

Peter Raaymakers said...

Guys, this has gone far beyond discussion of the issues. I'm going to close comments now, please refrain from any personal attacks as they're simply not constructive.

I look forward to your future comments on the subjects at hand.